[CPN] Fwd: Decision on proposal with respect to species
Cantino, Philip cantino at ohio.eduSun May 13 15:05:43 EDT 2012
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I like this suggestion. Phil On May 12, 2012, at 12:07 PM, Kevin Padian wrote: > Rather than sift through previous emails, some of which may have been > intended only for internal discussion, would it be better if individual > members elected to send Brent, Nico and David a summary of their previous > comments? > > After all the issue of accepting their proposal is closed and there is no > use in further debate and cluttering up everyone's mailbox ... > particularly if the committee wants to consider certain amendments now. > That would make a clean distinction, it seems to me. > > I agree with Phil about including the authors of the proposal in > discussion before a final decision is reached. Could I suggest another > way to do that? We might discuss this among ourselves for a while and > identify general consensus (if it exists) on the proposal. These points > could be summarized for the authors, who would then be asked to respond > (one hopes in no more than a few pages max). Then the committee could > discuss those points and make a final decision. Just a suggestion; it > might be a bit cleaner. -- kp > > >> This seems like a fair request. If the CPN agrees, I can easily add >> Brent, Nico and David to the listserv for the purpose of this discussion >> and then unsubscribe them after we are done discussing their proposal. If >> we agree to this, though, I think Dave (as CPN chair) will need to be >> assertive about cutting off discussion of particular points if it becomes >> clear that the pros and cons of that point are being stated repeatedly by >> the same people on each side. Otherwise, progress will slow to a snail's >> pace and everyone's time will be wasted. >> >> I'm not sure how best to give the proposal authors access to the points >> that led to our initial decision. This relates to the following in Dave's >> message yesterday: >> "Also, I wonder if we should post several of the responses and or snippets >> of the discussion for the authors and rest of the society to see? For >> example, I feel that Dick Olmstead's review that he shared with the >> committee, David Hillis' comments, and Kevin's response do a very good job >> of articulating the position of the CPN, and it seems like the authors and >> the society should be aware of these." The messages that Dave suggests >> are good choices, but I also suggest that we include my explanation of why >> I object strongly to permitting the conversion of specific epithets to >> clade names (i.e., the elimination of Art. 10.9); this is in a relatively >> short message that I sent to the CPN on January 11. Other members of the >> CPN may also want to include points made in their messages too. Perhaps >> each of us should choose particular points we would like to share with the >> authors of the proposal, and in addition let's send them David Hillis' >> comments. >> >> Phil >> >> >> Begin forwarded message: >> >> From: Brent Mishler >> < bmishler at calmail.berkeley.edu <mailto: bmishler at calmail.berkeley.edu >> >> Subject: Re: [CPN] Decision on proposal with respect to species >> Date: May 12, 2012 12:19:50 AM EDT >> To: David Tank < dtank at uidaho.edu <mailto: dtank at uidaho.edu >> >> Cc: Committee on Phylogenetic Nomenclature >> < cpn at listserv.ohio.edu <mailto: cpn at listserv.ohio.edu >>, David Baum >> < dbaum at facstaff.wisc.edu <mailto: dbaum at facstaff.wisc.edu >>, Nico Cellinese >> < ncellinese at flmnh.ufl.edu <mailto: ncellinese at flmnh.ufl.edu >> >> >> Hi Dave, >> >> Thanks for the news; it is better to hear it directly. I know there is >> not a lot of precedent for CPN procedure; I think we were the first >> "outside" proposal you had to deal with. So I'd like to suggest a >> procedural improvement: at some point it would be fair for us to have a >> chance to reply to points made by CPN members. So far it has been like a >> debate where only one side is allowed to actually debate. The people with >> vested interest in the current treatment of species in the Phylocode, >> Kevin and Phil, are in the debate and none of the three of us are. >> >> Just a thought, >> >> Best, >> >> Brent >> >> >> On May 11, 2012, at 7:17 PM, David Tank wrote: >> >> Dear Nico, Brent, and David, >> >> Thank you for your thoughtful proposal for changes to the PhyloCode with >> respect to species. The CPN has voted to reject the proposal as an entire >> entity but also decided to continue discussion to determine if there are >> elements of your proposal that we would like to incorporate in the next >> revision of the draft code. I apologize on behalf of the CPN for not >> having informed you promptly about the initial vote, an oversight that was >> related to the fact that we are still discussing elements of the proposal >> and thus view the decision-making process as still in progress. At the >> conclusion of this discussion, we will inform you of the outcome as well >> as posting the CPN decision on the news section of the ISPN website. >> >> All the best, >> Dave >>
>> David C. Tank >> Assistant Professor & Director, Stillinger Herbarium >> University of Idaho >> 208.885.7033 >> dtank at uidaho.edu <mailto: dtank at uidaho.edu > >> http://www.phylodiversity.net/dtank/ >> >> >> >> ********************************************************** >> Brent D. Mishler >> Professor, Department of Integrative Biology >> Director, University and Jepson Herbaria >> University of California, Berkeley >> Mailing address: >> UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA, BERKELEY >> UNIVERSITY AND JEPSON HERBARIA >> 1001 VALLEY LIFE SCIENCES BLDG # 2465 >> BERKELEY, CA 94720-2465 USA >> Office: 4164 VLSB >> Phone: (510) 642-6810 [office and lab] >> FAX: (510) 643-5390 >> E-mail: >> bmishler at calmail.berkeley.edu <mailto: bmishler at calmail.berkeley.edu > >> WWW: http://ucjeps.berkeley.edu/people/mishler.html >> ********************************************************** >> >>
>> CPN mailing list >> CPN at listserv.ohio.edu <mailto: CPN at listserv.ohio.edu > >> http://listserv.ohio.edu/mailman/listinfo/cpn >> >>
>> CPN mailing list >> CPN at listserv.ohio.edu >> http://listserv.ohio.edu/mailman/listinfo/cpn >> > > > -- > Kevin Padian > Department of Integrative Biology & > Museum of Paleontology > University of California, Berkeley CA 94720-3140 > 510-642-7434 > http://www.ucmp.berkeley.edu/people/padian/home.php > >
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